Response to a Swahili localization enthusiast
Those who read this blog may remember that we are trying to finalize a version of Firefox in Swahili. As it happens now and again, we have two groups who have completed translations at nearly the same time. The l10n-drivers team is now trying to find the most judicious solution to the problem: determining fairly which translation is best and shipping that. Amazingly, the differences between the the strings for the two localizations number in the thousands, and properly evaluating the discrepancies is a sizable undertaking for us to find the better version of the two. If you’d like to see the existing diff, comment here and we’ll send it your way. Now that we have a finalized Firefox 3.5, I’ve asked each team leader to update the strings in their language pack for final evaluation and we’ll prepare the final diff.
Sadly, amidst all we have done to ship Firefox to seventy-five locales, it was frustrating to read a blog post from one person suggesting that Mozilla’s l10n-drivers team is playing politics when it comes to shipping the Swahili version. If it needs to be made explicitly clear, we are in the business of shipping excellent localized software to as many locales as possible. If our team allowed politics to disrupt prudent judgment, I am not sure we would scale at all.
In his post, huarya writes, “The Mozilla people want to play nice with everyone instead of giving priority to the team that has actually showed results, real result!”. I responded extensively in the comment thread, an d here is a copy of my lengthy response for those who care to read it:
huayra: I’m not sure if we have ever spoken personally, so it seems a bit careless to suggest that we are playing politics. If we have spoken via email or IRC, then my apologies. You can find me on irc.mozilla.org, nick: sethb.
We ship Firefox now in 75 locales. We are not in the business of playing games. It’s about scaling our localization communities in the most sustainable way possible AND providing an excellent finished product.
But, as you can see through the comments in this post, you’ve planted the seed that our team at Mozilla is doing something dubious. We are not and that’s irresponsible on your part since you do not mention the full story in your post. Exactly what do you mean by “The Mozilla people want to play nice with everyone instead of giving priority to the team that has actually showed results, real result!”?
Here are the facts and consider rewriting your post:
We do have two language packs from the two teams with thousands of differences. With those two language packs, my team prepared a presentation of grammatical and translation differences between the two versions and reached out to many different linguistic professors who have expertise in East African Language Studies. One was eager to help and we are trying to get a final evaluation from him since he wants to get sw-TZ users a version of Firefox. Another academic contact requested tens of thousands of dollars to do the evaluation and we cannot fund that since no other locale has been afforded any funding to help settle disputes. A final academic contact did a rough evaluation, said that both translations contained many errors, he wouldn’t be comfortable with either, and would need to charge Mozilla a fee for him to do the thorough evaluation. These responses come from department heads at leading universities.
Playing politics would be something less prudent.
Please also keep in mind that we have several things going on right now, not the least of which is shipping Firefox to 75 locales to our 300+ million users who want updates to Firefox 3.5. In addition, we are actively working with many other new locales who want to participate. Yes, sw-TZ has been trying to localize Firefox for many years now. But, we are responding to requests from all over the world and do our best to manage it all and have done fairly well since we have scaled to 75 localizations. Most importantly, we want our end users to have something that is an excellent finished product.
sw-TZ is unique because we have two translations asking to be the official one. We are seeking the most judicious result as possible because surely one team will be quite disappointed if their translation is not chosen. The team at Mozilla is the group who deals with the aftermath of that decision. And, not making a wise decision would only complicate things.
I’d ask for your patience and understanding as we come to a resolution. And, please minimize the flaming when you don’t have all the facts. Not sure how that helps.
Thanks Seth!
I have answered to your reply:
“I am not sure it helps either, but the post was provocative enough to create attention around the issue which should help us all getting things done. As the pragmatical (as in πρᾶγμα=action) person I am that is my only goal: To see Firefox officially translated to Swahili!”
you can read the rest here
Has either team attempted to resolve the differences between the two localizations? They should be responsible for explaining the differences, and present arguments for each differing string. You shouldn’t simply take one localization in whole over the other. A combination of the two will surely be better than either one alone. Take the time to get it right.
Seth,
I am a teacher at a secondary school here in Tanzania. About 99% of our computer users are native Swahili speakers, and I would like to install a Swahili version of Firefox into our 15 computers as soon as possible. You mention that you will send the diff to interested parties. I am interested. Could you email it to me? Thanks. And good luck sorting out this cluster…
My name is Allan Kaitila,I am an ICT (Information and Communication Technology)tutor at Teachers’ college here in Tanzania,we have been working with the community translation along Mozilla Firefox.I would like to get the difference of the two Swahili language packs.
Then I will give my comments for which one to choose.In my opinion,the best Swahili language in computer is that which comes from the community rather than that comes from the experts,this is because experts language will need a lot of money for teaching the community the new Swahili Technological terms which for underdeveloped country like Tanzania is very difficult to get fund for teaching the community about the new Swahili technological terms,and that is why in Kenya computer Swahili language is very easy that avery member of community can afford to learn himself without consulting experts because most of the words they originates from the community.Let me take some of technological terms used in computers like a mouse,Swahili-Tanzania is “kiteuzi”(selector),Swahili-Kenya is “Kipanya” (mouse).The word “Kiteuzi” comes from Tanzanian experts,and “kipanya” (mouse) is community based from Kenya.So community based language is good than experts language based.As long as I will continue to give my suggestions for Mozilla Swahili Language and please notify me for any new releases.
Lastly is that Mozilla Firefox is good and we are teaching our community Mozilla Firefox because the browser is very smart,and has no problem with virus (is virus protector)with many applications on its add-ons.Currently in our institution we are using Firefox 3.5b5pre.sw.langpack.xpi to teach to the expected teachers which replaced Internet explorer that was used before in Tanzania syllabubs.
Thanks Mozilla Firefox,you did great job and many Swahili speakers are waiting for the new Firefox Swahili language.i saw many Swahili speakers are very interested in a their language Kiswahili instead of English.
Thanks!!!
Hi! Setht, where is the link to download those two versions of Kiswahili Mozilla Firefox 3.5 so that I can browse and give my comments.
Note. Official word for the language is “Kiswahili” and note “Swahili”
Hi! Seth, I went through various comments given, and your reply as well. To me I see that there are people trying to push you to release the product without proper analysis. You just take your time and do your commendable job. If these teams want better work, why don’t they team up and come with one product? I concur with your approach. It seems one team is attacking the other, and the other one is just remaining silent without hitting back. To me the team which dont hitting back is more wise they are just doing their work with great care so that a better product can be released.
Just give me the link for reviewing the two versions.
Juma.
Juma John: I tried to respond to you via email with the information but your email returned invalid. If you are tracking this thread, please email me at sethb at mozilla dot com. -Seth
I don’t think it is beneficial for Mozilla to get entangled into the dispute over the precedence of the translations.
Would it be possible to suggest to the teams that they work out their differences and submit a single unified l10n? This way Mozilla would be out of the dispute altogether, and the teams would be compelled to find a solution.
Hi Filip:
I tried that early on and it didn’t work too well.
This seems to be the best way going forward.
-Seth
Hi Juma (and I guess Seth)
Swahili is the correct name for the language in English and Seth wrote this article in English. Kiswahili is the correct name for the language when spoken in Swahili.
Seth is not wrong using Swahili any more then when he uses the terms Japanese, Chinese, Korean or Vietnamese which are obviously not written that way in their mother tongue and are most likely also have some official rendering.
Unless of course you are advocating that in the Swahili version of Firefox we should use language names like this অসমীয়া, Беларуская, 中文, Français, Magyar, Gaeilge, Tiếng Việt or Cymraeg. In which case I’m pretty sure a Swahili speaker would much prefer English names or at least names transliterated into Swahili.
I am one of the member that was heavily involved with one of the translation, tzLUG Pack. I agree with comments above. The one that shined the most for me was that a “combination of our translations will be the best than any of the two”. We have our PO files available on the IT+46 SVN server and anyone is more than welcome to download them and make use of them ensuring that we have a better Kiswahili Firefox.
I have tried to reach to the other group but we have not manage to find a common ground. I have not given up. I am still working on this and I hope to work with Kilinux some time in the very near future.
Those that have been using it, please do not hesitate to send me your comment I will make them available as soon as I get them. We will update our files and make another language pack available as soon as possible.
Send your comment to tzlug@linuxgroup.co.tz or info@linuxgroup.co.tz